EAC-PM Member Shamika Ravi Reacts to Asaduddin Owaisi's Claims on Hindus Declining Report

New Delhi:  latest report by Economic visory Council to Prime Minister (EAC-PM) on majority population, including Hindus, on a decline has led to a controversy nationwide. Dr Shamika Ravi, Economist, Member, EAC-PM and Author of latest EAC-PM report on population, spoke to Republic Media Network Editor-in-Chief Arnab Goswami on report showing a decline in Hindu population and an increase in Muslim minority population from 1950 to 2015.

When Arnab Goswami asked Shamika if she was expecting this kind of public and trending conversation around EAC-PM report, Shamika Ravi replied, “I don’t think anyone is surprised with se numbers…maybe numbers may be new, but levels and broly what changes are, it’s not new at all. I think it is election season perhaps that is making it so exciting. But frankly, se are long-term changes, most economists are familiar with.”

Arnab asked wher a 7.8% decline is a steep fall for any community around world, and would it mean that around 10 crore or 100 million Hindus are less now as compared to post-Independence era.

“se are shares, so in absolute terms, because for every religion, population is always expanding…we have h a major expansion in size of every demographic in every religious group. It is relative share of each religious group and that too, minorities, which becomes an interesting phenomenon,” said Shamika.

economist went on to elaborate, “What India is following or experience that India has h over last 65 years is akin to most Western, liberal, plural democracies, where share of majority has gone down and minority has gone up, contrary to countries of region. So our neighbourhood, we are quite unique,” said Shamika Ravi. 

“In India, we have h second largest decline in majority population, which is about 7.82 per cent - refore a commensurate increase in minority as a group. All or countries in neighbourhood - Banglesh, Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Bhutan, Afghanistan - have all h an alarming decline in proportion of share of minorities. In that sense, re is a novelty to this research,” explained Shamika Ravi.

On Asuddin Owaisi’s claims of ‘WhatsApp University’ report on population

Arnab went on to ask Shamika on her reaction to All-India Majlis-e-Ittehul Muslimeen (AIMIM) chief Asuddin Owaisi’s claims of EAC-PM report being from ‘WhatsApp University’, meaning it was fictitious.

To which, Shamika replied, “It’s a report by three researchers using publicly available data. I’m a little surprised it has surprised people. I’m also surprised that it has taken us time to do analysis on things which are so obvious and that we should be doing on a routine basis.”

‘India should regularly measure population’

eminent economist went on to explain that India is one of few countries that have a dedicated ministry for minorities, and refore a study is incumbent. 

“re are very few countries that actually define minorities or are interested in protection of minorities. But India has followed se UN (United Nations) norms, se progressive, modern norms. In fact, we are one of very few countries that have a dedicated ministry for minorities. Now, given kind of policy priority minority welfare has, given kind of resources that are spent, don’t we want to assess what outcomes are? So, why is it that we are not measuring se realities on ground? In fact, this should become a regular, routine exercise. It should really not be left to interest. And that is what it is.”

What is finding on plight of Muslims of India?

Arnab sought Shamika’s opinion on wher plight of Muslims should also be measured. People may say that EAC-PM has a vested interest in report. Is it a stilted perspective?

“We do have or studies that have looked at availability of amenities, even development indicators across religious and social groups, etc. So, what you’re calling ‘plight’, I think we have to put an objective variable, which can be measured. condition of most minority groups has improved dramatically,” said Shamika.

She ded, “Now, Why don’t we look at share of minority population? It’s final outcome metric. In a discriminatory environment, when you have not just policies but generally a community or a society, which is leing to plight of any one group or anor, or minorities in general, (n) you’re not going to see a significant increase in population. As is case in many countries, and particularly in our neighbourhood.”

“So, it’s a very good composite metric. It’s a very good variable,” Shamika furr elaborated, ding, “Just like, if you have a very skewed sex ratio, we know that women are being discriminated against. So, I think that re is a scientific basis to say that se are objective measures and we must look at it.”

What are drivers of change in population share?

Shamika Ravi spoke about an important point to be looked at in this scenario. “But one important point to make is that, we are not looking at drivers of this change, as to what is leing to changes in share of population will not just include fertility rates and birth rates... It’s difference in rates that will eventually determine share.” Shamika ded that it is a very sophisticated point that is important for people to understand.

Is Conversion reason for decline in Hindu population in India?

Shamika spoke about factors like migration and conversion in population change. She explained, “But also migration - illegal or illegal - and n conversion. You see, in Europe, most countries have seen a decline in majority religion on account of mass migration. But in Africa, 24 countries used to have Animism as majority religion. In 65 years, none of se 24 countries have Animism as majority religion. So, now we are not talking of birth rate or migration, we are talking conversion. And obviously, it is a combination of all se factors that is leing to final outcome. This paper ( EAC-PM report) is first step to put out objectively, Step Number 1. Now we need to look more into details.”

EAM-PC said on X about report, “India has seen second most significant decline in majority population (7.82%), only next to Myanmar (10%) within immediate South Asian neighbourhood. Minority populations have shrunk substantially in Banglesh, Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Bhutan and Afghanistan.”